I"ve created a katifund.org with background music. The background music is licensed under Creative Commons. Link (contains a download button):
Please click on the "Awareness (Ambient Lounge Mix)" text to be directed to the license description.

You are watching: The orchard music scam

I can dispute the rejected decision again. Two things can happen then.

I fear that option 2 will be applied. I did some research and found valuable sources.


I have three questions actually:

How is it possible that Orchard Music can claim ownership of a Creative Commons music production?Why do I need a publishing license to a Creative Commons music production?Should I dispute the claim for the second time?
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edited Dec 10 "16 at 8:18
Julian Sawicki
asked Dec 9 "16 at 5:59

Julian SawickiJulian Sawicki
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Ok, this is quite a complicated problem actually, and depending on the specific situation, the answer might vary. So I"ll break this down in a couple of subsections.

CC licences and unauthorized distribution

Creative Commons are a set of licences that allow creators to distribute their original content (e.g. music) using liberal licences under easy to understand terms. However, in order to do so, the uploader needs to hold the rights to the music (usually this means they are the creator). If they don"t, they have no right to grant any permissions regarding the use of that music. It"s your responsibility to check if they do have those rights.

Excerpt from my answer here:

In short, just because someone uploads a Hannah Montana album to some website and puts a CC icon next to it, you still can"t use Best of Both Worlds in your katifund.org. And if you do, you can"t rely on your claim that you got it from that site, because the uploader didn"t hold the rights to that music in the first place and it would"ve been your responsibility to check if they do.

tl;dr: Always make sure that uploader of whatever music you want to use actually made that music.

In your case, the Soundcloud account looks to be legit, so let"s proceed.

CC licenses and retractability

The licensor cannot revoke these freedoms as long as you follow the license terms.

What this means is as long as you uphold the terms of the licence, the uploader can"t retract the permissions granted by the CC licence. Of course that doesn"t mean he has to continue distribution his works indefinetely. But if a music creator at some point decides to stop distributing his work under a CC licence, this doesn"t affect any work using his music (e.g. your YouTube katifund.org) that was created before that time.

(Note: If an artist at some point stops distributing his music under a CC licence, from that point onwards you can"t rightfully publish any new work using his music, even if you downloaded it while it was still CC licenced. The non-retractibility only affects works published while the music was being distributed under a CC licence.)

However, being right isn"t all there is to it. There"s a saying in German:

Recht haben und Recht bekommen sind zwei Paar Schuhe.

YouTube"s ID system

"In the beginning the YouTube ID system was created. This has made a lot of people very angry and been widely regarded as a bad move"

The Orchard Group

The Orchard"s YouTube multi-channel network has more than 1,000 channels across the globe and uses technology, built in-house, called B.A.C.O.N. (Bulk Automated Claiming on The Orchard Network) to crawl, claim and track YouTube katifund.orgs to monetize for their clients. It was ranked 7th in the U.S. in July 2014.

Source: Wikipedia

In this context, The Orchard has been criticized by YouTube users for claiming content that is not theirs or in some cases, content that did not exist within the katifund.org at all. In a blog post on The Daily Rind, The Orchard explains that this is due to YouTube"s automated Content ID matching and outlines steps for resolving this scenario.

So, you got two automated systems that can both screw up and have been shown to do so often. Not an ideal situation for content creators. If you get caught in such an automated system, the solution is almost always to contact the people responsible for it. Contact the Orchard Group and possibly also contact the original artist of the music. If they are indeed not trying to scam anyone, they will be willing to help you. If the Orchard Group doesn"t reply, public shaming on Twitter oftentimes helps you get in touch with an actual person, not just with an email autoresponder.

Your questions

How is it possible that Orchard Music can claim ownership of a Creative Commons music production?

As mentioned, this is mostly done by automated systems that are prone to misfires, especially if larger distribution/collection companies are involved. Also, you can claim anything, that doesn"t mean you actually have any lawful grounds on which your claim is based. I can claim that I be crowned High King of the Universe, but nobody will have to call me Your Majesty. And if I sue them, I"m unlikely to win that case.

Why do I need a publishing license to a Creative Commons music production?

You don"t. The CC licence gives you the right to publish your katifund.org if you follow the terms laid out in the licence, you don"t need to pay any additional licence fees or royalties. However, a human error is also possible.

For example, maybe the artist is represented by the Orchard Group and never intended to publish their work under a CC licence. Maybe they just forgot to change that setting while uploading their music to Soundcloud. I"m not sure about Soundcloud, but if you for example upload something to Vimeo, a CC-BY licence is applied by default, and you have to go into a submenu of the settings to change that. I think that is a terrible implementation, but that"s how it is.

Even if that case, you would probably be within your rights to invoke the licence terms the author published his music under, but it might not be feasible or realistic to do so and see your claim through.

Should I dispute the claim for the second time?

That is your decision. Before you do anything, check if you followed all the licence terms, the legitimacy of your music source and everything else mentioned in this post. It might also be better to contact the Orchard Group or the artist directly to see if you can"t get the issue resolved without involving YouTube as a third party. Though a lawyer would probably tell you that contacting them is the worst thing to do if you plan to follow this up with a lawsuit.

See more: How To Make A Cross Christmas Tree S, Pin On Christmas Ideas For Next Year

Just remember, being right doesn"t mean YouTube will take your side. And if they don"t, there"s little you can do besides suing, which might not be feasible for you.